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QUESTIONS ARISING FROM 102nd. MEETING – 28/6/19
(the record of earlier meetings can be downloaded from the main Circulus page as can the version of Ciceronis Filius with illustrations added. The illustrated text of Genesis is available on the Genesis page and of Kepler's Somnium on the Somnium page.)

Food ordered included okrum arōmaticum (bhindi masala, `lady’s fingers’, okra with spices),  cicera arōmatica (chana masala, chickpeas with spices), melongēna contūsa (baigan bharta, mashed aubergine/eggplant), spināchia cum caseō (palak paneer, spinach with cheese) carnēs assae mixtae (mixed grill), iogurtum cum holeribus contūsīs (raita, yohurt with chopped vegetables), pānis tenuis (papadom), pānis Persicus (nan), orӯza (plain rice), orӯza pilavēnsis cum holeribus (vegetable pilau, i.e rice cooked with vegetables in broth) and, of course, vīnum rubrum/sanguineum, pōtiō iogurtīna (lassi) and nux Indica (coconut)
 
`Okra’ could also be Latinized as ocra, -ae f or with its rather clumsy botanical name Abelmoschus esculentus. The vegetable’s distribution is from tropical to warm-temperate regions, including in Hong Kong, while Ethiopia, South Asia and West Africa have all been suggested as its place of origin (see https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Okra).
 
Eugene demonstrated some of his continuing work on the speech synthesis of Latin text, for which he is now developing colour coding. There are some examples of his results at https://linguae.weebly.com/latin-speech-engines.html   John was impressed but pointed out that using the system to get new texts read aloud required sophisticated computer skills and wondered if it would be possible to develop an `idiot-friendly’ dialogue box where we could simply paste in the words to generate the right sounds. Eugene thought this would be technically very difficult to do on our own, There is, though a facility of this kind provided by the Acapela site (see illustration below), which allows 300 characters can be processed at a time in the free version. Only modern languages are available, but these include Greek, so Homer, the New Testament etc. can be processed as long as you don’t mind the modern pronunciation. 
Picture
​Malcolm mentioned Göbekli Tepe in SE Turkey (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/G%C3%B6bekli_Tepe), a Stone Age structure possibly dating from around 9000 B.C. – 6.000 years before the Pyramids and Stonehenge. He will be visiting the site himself this summer
Picture
                                                                                                       Göbekli Tepe
                      https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/G%C3%B6bekli_Tepe#/media/File:G%C3%B6bekli_Tepe,_Urfa.jpg
 
We read lines 177-231 of Aenedi IV and Tanya asked about a possible connection between the verb condō and English conduit. In fact the latter derives from condūcō ( -dūcere, -dūxī, -ductum), `lead together’, `hire’. Words from condō (condere, condidī, conditum, `place together, found, build, hide, bury’) include recondite and (via the variant verb condīre, `place in spices’, `pickle’) condiment. The family of verbs in –dō, -didī, -ditum derive ultimately from the PIE root *dhe (place, put) and, despite what John told his students until recently, not from dō, dare, dedī, datum (give), which developed from the PIE root with the same meaning, *do-  The perfect participle conditus –a, -um is used in the phrase Ab Urbe Conditā (`from the city founded’, i.e. `from the foundation of the city’). Abbreviated to A.U.C. this was used in a system of dating events from a base line of 753 B.C., the supposed year of Rome’s foundation (see https://linguae.weebly.com/roman-calendar.html)


Picture
                                                                                        Buddha Eyes  
                                                   https://www.ancient-symbols.com/buddhist-symbols.html
 
Someone asked if there was an etymological link between the Latin fāma (fame, reputation, rumour) and Greek φημί (phēmi, I say) and both in fact serive from PIE *bha- (speak, say). The Roman personification of rumour (Fāma with initial capital in modern printed texts) is described by Virgil as possessing eyes beneath all of the feathers that cover its body and Zhang Wei wondered whether there could be a link between this symbolism and the `Buddha Eyes’ or `Wisdom Eyes’ depicted on the sides of Buddhist monuments,  Although in both cases there is an underlying idea of nothing escaping notice, a direct connection is unlikely as the Buddha’s vision was seen as a positive force,
 
Malcolm again recommended Jessye Norman’s performance of `Dido’s Lament’, the mournful aria from Purcell’s Dido and Aeneas, which can be found at https://youtu.be/eRyec66Jp2c
John reported that he had finally got round to writing a suitably respectful letter to Professor Mary Beard, the UK’s leading historian of Rome, for a ruling on an argument between Malcolm and a friend over whether the Roman Empire reached its maximum extent under Trajan (98-117) or Septimius Severus (193 to 211) . John himself had thought we probably lacked the precise information to settle the question and Dame Mary’s rapid reply took the same line: `I think you are right. We can’t know for sure .. and it depends on how we define the borders. So there are different ideas. M’
 
John, who was preparing a lecture on earthquakes in Nepal (PowerPoint now available at the bottom of https://linguae.weebly.com/nepali.html ), mentioned the claim by James Palmer in his The Death of Mao: The Tangshan Earthquake and the Birth of the New China (London: Faber & Faber, 2012) that revulsion at the callous attitude of the `Gang of Four’ towards the victims of the July 1976 Tangshang earthquake had been a factor in their downfall shortly after Mao’s death the following month. Both Zhang Wei, who had been living in Beijing at the time and felt the earthquake, and Malcolm were sceptical about this. However, Zhang Wei later attended the lecture at the Hong Kong Anthropological Society and suggested that Mao’s death, which undoubtedly triggered the political changes, could have been hastened by the disaster.  Mao himself, though an atheist, was superstitious and susceptible to the old Chinese belief about rulers being in some way at fault when natural disasters occurred.
 
Malcolm referred to Mao’s record of causing more deaths than Stalin and Hitler combined and he recommended Weijian Shan’s Out of the Gobi; My Story of China and America for the disaster caused by the Great Leap Forward. Both Malcolm and I had heard of but not yet seen Julia Lovell’s Maoism – a global history, which looked at the influence of Mao’s theories and example outside China and included a chapter on Nepal.
 
AENEID IV 177-231

[fāma] ingrediturque solō et caput inter nūbila condit.
and-walks-upon   the-ground and  head  among  clouds buries
illam Terra parēns īrā inrītāta deōrum
her      earth   prent   by-anger provoked  at-the-gods
extrēmam, ut perhibent, Coeō Enceladōque[1] sorōrem
last         as   they-relate for Coeus and-Encelasus    sister
prōgenuit pedibus celerem et pernīcibus ālīs,               180
gave-birth-to  on-feet     swift     and with-desturctive wings
mōnstrum horrendum, ingēns, cui quot    sunt corpore plūmae,
horrible       monster         huge    to-whom as-many-as  are  on-body    feathers
tot vigilēs oculī subter (mīrābile dictū),
so-many watchful  eyes   underneath   strange to-say
tot linguae, totidem      ōra sonant,    tot subrigit aurīs.
So-many tongues  same-number-of   mouths  make-sound  so-many she-pricks-up  ears
nocte volat caelī mediō terraeque[2] per umbram
by-night  she-flies of-heaven  in-middle and-of-earth through shadow
strīdēns, nec dulcī dēclīnat lūmina somnō;               185
hissing   an-not  in-sweer  shuts   eyes      sleep
lūce sedet cūstōs aut summī culmine tēctī
in-daylight sits  as-sentinel either of-top  on-roof  of-building
turribus aut altīs, et magnās territat urbēs,
on-towers   or   high  and   great   terrifies    cities
tam fictī prāvīque tenāx      quam nūntia vērī.
As-much of-falsehood and-of-evil  tenacious   as    announcer  of-truth
haec tum multiplicī populōs sermōne replēbat
she    then  with-manifold   peoples      speech  was-filling
gaudēns, et pariter facta atque īnfecta canēbat:               190
joyfully     and  equally  facts    and   fictions  was-singing
vēnisse Aenēān Troiānō sanguine crētum,
to-have-come  Aeneas   from-Trojan   blood   born
cui sē pulchra virō dignētur iungere Dīdō;
to-which herself  beautiful  sees-fit     to-join   Dido
nunc hiemem inter sē     luxū, quam longa, fovēre
now    winter     among themselves in-sensuality as    long [as it lasted]  were-keeping-warm
rēgnōrum immemorēs turpīque cupīdine captōs.[3]
of-kinfdoms   forgetful       and-by-disgraceful  lust  captured
haec passim     dea foeda virum diffundit in ōra.      195
these-things  everywhere  goddess  vile  of-men  scatters   into  mouths
prōtinus ad rēgem cursus dētorquet Iarbān[4]
immediately  to   king   path    she-turns     Iarbas
incenditque animum dictīs atque aggerat īrās.
and-inflames    [his]mind with-words and    builds-up  [his]anger
Hic[5] Hammōne[6]satus raptā Garamantide[7] nymphā
This-man    from-Hammon  born by-ravished   Garamantian  nymph
templa Iovī centum lātīs  immānia rēgnīs,
temples to-Juppiter hundered  in-broad  vast      realms
centum ārās posuit vigilemque sacrāverat ignem,         200
hundred  altars  placed  and-watchful  had-consecrated  fire
excubiās dīvum aeternās, pecudumque cruōre
sentinel       of-gods   eternal     and-of-herds     with-blood
pingue solum et variīs flōrentia līmina sertīs.[8]
rich     the-ground  with-various resplendent  thresholds garlands
isque āmēns animī[9] et rūmōre accēnsus amārō
and-he    maddened in-soul and  by-rumous   indlamed  bitter
dīcitur ante ārās media inter nūmina   dīvum[10]
is-said     before altars in-middle between  divine-powers of-gods
multa Iovem manibus    supplex ōrāsse[11] supīnīs:               205
many-things (from) Juppiter with-hands  as-a-supplianr to-have-begged turned-upwards
'Iuppiter omnipotēns, cui nunc Maurūsia[12] pictīs
Juppiter       all-mighty    to-whom  now   Mauretanian -embroidered
gēns epulāta torīs Lēnaeum[13] lībat honōrem,
race    feasting       couches  of-wine              offers   the-honour
aspicis haec? an tē, genitor, cum fulmina torquēs
do-you-see-this    or   you    father  whe  thunder-bolts you-hurl
nēquīquam horrēmus, caecīque in nūbibus ignēs
in-vain         are-wein-awe-of  and-blindly in    the-clouds lightnng
terrificant animōs et inānia murmura[14] miscent?               210
terrifies      minds     and  meaningless roaring    stir-up
fēmina, quae nostrīs errāns in fīnibus urbem
woman     who  our       wondering in territories  city
exiguam pretiō posuit,  cui       lītus     arandum
small      for-a-price established  to-whom stretch-of-shore shore  for-ploughing 
cuique locī    lēgēs[15] dedimus, cōnūbia    nostra
and-to-whom  of-place l aws       we-gave   [offer-of] marriage   our
reppulit ac dominum Aenēān in rēgna recēpit.
repulsed  and   [as] lord       Aeneas   into  kingdom  received  
et nunc ille Paris cum sēmivirō comitātū,                215
and now   that  Paris  with  of-half-men    retinue
Maeoniā[16] mentum mitrā crīnemque madentem
With-Maeonian   chin    turban   and-hair      reeking [of perfume]
subnexus, raptō[17] potītur:  nōs mūnera templīs
tied-up       what-was-deized posseses  we   gifts      to-temples
quippe tuīs ferimus fāmamque fovēmus inānem.'[18]
Of-course  your   bring    and-reputation   we-cherish   empty
Tālibus ōrantem dictīs ārāsque tenentem
with-such   [him] praying  words and-altars  holding
audiit Omnipotēns, oculōsque ad moenia torsit               220
heard    All-mighty-one    and-eyes     to    walls   turned
rēgia et oblītōs fāmae meliōris amantīs.
of-palace and   forgetful   of-reputation better  lovers
tum sīc Mercurium adloquitur ac tālia mandat:
then  thus    Mercury      he-addresses  and such   gives-orders
'vāde age, nāte, vocā Zephyrōs et lābere pennīs
Go      now  son    call   west-winds  and  glide    on-wings
Dardaniumque ducem, Tyriā Karthāgine quī nunc
And-Trojan          leader     in-Tyrian   Carthage  who   now
exspectat fātīsque datās nōn respicit urbēs,[19]               225
waits  and-   by-fate    given  not has-regard-for cities
adloquere et celerīs dēfer mea dicta per aurās.
speak-to     and  swift carry-down  my   words through air
nōn illum nōbīs genetrīx pulcherrima tālem
not    him    to-us     mother    most-beautiful  such
prōmīsit Grāiumque ideō     bis vindicat armīs;[20]
promised     and-of-Greeks  for-this-reason  twice defended   from-arms
sed fore      quī gravidam imperiīs bellōque frementem
but  to-be-going-to-be one-who  pregnant-with empire  and-in-war  raging
Ītaliam regeret,[21] genus altō ā sanguine Teucrī[22]               230
Italy      would-rule                  race   noble from   blood  of-Teucer
prōderet, ac tōtum sub lēgēs mitteret orbem.[23]
propagare   and   whole   under laws should-send  world
 

NOTES
[1] Earth is said to have given birth to Rumour and the other Giants in anger at the gods for destroying the Titans, who had also been Earth’s offspring. Virgil, like many others, confuses the two categories as Coeus was in fact a Titan and Enceladus a Giant, who supposedly, like Typhoeus, was buried under Mt. Etna in Sicily. See notes at http://dcc.dickinson.edu/vergil-aeneid/vergil-aeneid-iv-173-197
[2] i.e. in between geaven and earth
[3] Accusative and infinitive construction giving the content of the rumours.
[4] Iarbas was the king of a neighbouring tribe and, by Pompeius Trogus’ account (see the details at https://linguae.weebly.com/conventus-apr-2019.html ), it was actually to avoid marriage to him that Dido had committed suicide,
[5] hic is the nominative singular masculine of hic, haec, hoc and thus has a short vowel (in contrast to hīc, `here’) but before a word behinning with `h’ or a vowel the final `c’ is pronounced double, making the syllable long,
[6] Hammon (or Ammon) was a ram-headed Libyan god equated with Jupiter. It is uncertain whether he should be connected with the Phoenician and Carthaginian god Ba’al Hammon, who the Greeks and Romans generally identified with Chronos/Saturn, See https://www.livius.org/articles/place/ammon-siwa/ammon-deity/
[7] The Garamantes were a nomadic tribe – or collection of tribes – living in the Sahara to the south of Carthaginian and Numidian territory (see https://www.livius.org/articles/place/garamantes/ in what is now SW Libya. Some scholars believe they dominated a much larger area (see map)
[8] The use of the pluperfect sacrāverat in line 20 suggests that the ever-burning fires were established before the temples were constructed. As pecudumque…līmina sertīs refer more naturally to the temples, pingue solum and līmina are then best taken as nominatives with the verb understood (`The floor is rich…’)
[9] Probanly a locative, even though in prose only names of cities and dmall islands, plus, humus (hround), rūs (`countyside’) and domus (`home’) have this case.
[10] `amidst the divind presences’ would be an idiomatic translation
[11] Abbreviation of ōrāvisse from ōrō (1), which takes a double accusarive.
[12] Mauretania in ancient times stretched from what is now central Algeria west to the Atlanti cand south to the Atlas Mountains. The name of the modern stte of Mauritania, situated on the Atlantiv coast further south is derived from it but situated on different territory,
[13] Lenaeus is another name for Bacchus, god of wine. Gods were frequently honoured by pouring winr onto the ground or onto their altar,
[14] murmur, murmoris n could refer to a low-pitched rumbling as well as to a low-volume, unclear sound.
[15] Iarbas’s expression is tantamount to `conditions of tenure’
[16] Maeōnia was an old name for Lydia, the kingdom which once covered much of Western Anatolia. A mitra, the word from which `mitre’ (bishop’s head-dress) derives was a headband, turban or bonnet, the wearing of which (or of any headgear other than a helmet in battle) was regarded as effeminate by the Romans. Iarbas equates the union of Aeneas and Didi with Paris’s abduction of Helen from Sparta.
[17] raptō is neuter ablative singular with lītore or rēgnō understood.
[18] One suggested idiomatic translation: `hug to our hearts an empty name.’
[19] The plural here is probably just used for singular, as very often in poetry, and so refers only to the future Rome. It is just possible that it is meant to include the earlier foundations of Lavinia (by Aeneas and himself) and of Alba Longa (by his son Iulus/Ascanius)
[20] The reference is to Venus saving her son from the Greek Diomedesearler in the air and then protecting him when Troy fell.
[21] Pharr suggsest that referet, prōderet and mitteret
[22] Teucer was the first king of Troy.
[23] This phrase might possibly refer to a supposed `civilising mission’ but more likely simply to the act of bringing others under one’s own jurisdiction,
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